The Over-Proliferation of HE in World of Warships

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Today we talk about a topic on the minds of everyone right now, especially after the introduction of the line. Is there too much ? Before that, be sure to get entered for a here:

https://gleam.io/competitions/WCFhk--belfast-giveaway

So about that HE… Worlf of Warships awoke a sleeping dragon. BBs using HE is not a new concept, and all BBs have a very high chance of starting fires. I think the RN BBs just brought it to our attention because now everyone is using it. Is this good? Is it bad? I’ll let you decide.

20 Comments:

  1. Cannot citadel the German BBs, It’s insanely hard to citadel American Battleships now, Yamato can just bow-tank everyone else. This seems to be more of an issue than the high fire chance, because it makes AP against battleships so much more unreliable than HE is. Nerfing HE and Fires is just fighting the symptoms.

  2. You contradict yourself too much and you repeat your points too often.

    As an example you say destroyers and cruisers need HE and battleships don’t, but then to justify it you say that HE has no effect on armoured targets and so battleships shouldn’t us it, but if that was so then destroyer and cruiser HE would also do nothing to battleships leaving them with only their torpedoes.

    I think the problem war gaming has is their overall game design is too simple to be functional as things are added, perhaps they should look at the game play for steel ocean and take some notes. I say that as a fan of both games.

  3. Sat in a smoke cloud with my teammate last night…we both had Kutuzovs. Me with IFHE…my division mate without it. Both with Dem Expert. And we melted a Conqueror sailing past the cap. He bitched for a bit about being melted by ships in smoke…. something thats been around for a while now. Until it got pointed out to him that he sure as hell didnt grind or make his to T10 in the RN BB line to get the Conqueror so he fling some AP at ships. Conversation over…

  4. Anti-RNers lets just boycott this game til they fix it.

  5. I play the Dunkerque a lot and frankly, WAY TOO MANY ships shoot only AP at the bow, it was just laughable how many enemy shells just amounted to nothing. I was long an advocate for firing Battleship HE on the forums, but I guess I was an odd one out since cruisers players preferred getting sunk by my HE.

  6. Zoup, in truth it doesn’t matter. This is the meta WG wants for this game. They’ve already stated there are ‘too many BBs’ in the game. Now they’re going got come out with magical deep running torpedoes and they have the stupendous HE for the British BBs to set the world aflame. They want ships to die fast so people will play more battles. It isn’t about skill anymore, it’s about the grind and how many battles they can get while farming us for our $$. You are spot on that HE does not require the skill to aim to make it effective like you do with AP. HE spam is easy mode mechanic that only requires to have a decent lead on the target fire it and farm the XP and Credits for the dual damage that HE does (explosive and DoT damage). They will not change a thing because this is exactly what they want.

  7. i think a new fire mechanic should be implemented instead (sadly it might be too complex for wg to implement). What i think could work is that instead of a raw rng roll for fires and percentage, it does like a meter thing where for each he shell that hits your ship (i think a difference between a pen and shatter should also be included i will get to that). e.g when an he shell pens your ship it does it’s pen dmg and adds to a meter (dont think it should be visible again depends on how this will work) as the meter increases with each shell hit, it build it up until over a certain limit then rng can kick in to start fires. However after a set time is passed after a shell hit, the meter begins to decrease e.g 15-20 secs (that number is chosen on purpose). Thus the we will no longer get that one shell rng fire situation (not as much as least) and i think more teamplay can be introduced as players will saturate a target with he to start fires. Some basic questions to answer, one i think a pen and shatter should differ in how much they add to the fire start meter shatter being obviously less. the 15-20 sec timer is to ensure that bb’s cannot soley set fires on their own at least, it takes a lot longer without compromising a cruiser’s ability to set fires. Again this mechanic is just an idea and there are plenty of questions that need to be dealt with (probs too many which will cause it not to be implemented). however i think this is a good start on fixing the “he spam from bb’s” at least. (ca’s should be allowed to he spam the crap out of bb’s, part of the game, again anther problem that will need a solution)

  8. I think the issue is the entire damage system and feel fundamentally the whole thing would need to be replaced, or at least, drastically overhauled. Including the introduction of armor immunity zones and others. I could go on endlessly with ideas, including giving all ships passive repair rates, changing how HE shells and fire/flooding works, perhaps including crew efficiency and crew loss (a secondary system that changes the effectiveness of repair/damage control etc). The problem with things now is that you can only push and pull in so many ways when everything is interconnected and on top of that every mechanic is game wide. The devs mentioned how they could adjust AP pen rate, but that would then mean cruisers would get nerfed as result. I feel theres just too few “factors” to balance currently and we need more systems in place to give each nation a flair and allow more balancing.

  9. oh thank god you said that about the chance being to high…… andt he lowest common denominator i lvoe it fire prevention doesnt do enough to prevent any fires only good thing about it is that it takes away the 4th spot but its bad last 6 games today i got hit first volley insta fire. also if you are playing he uk BB youa re playing for the long drawn out game the longer the game goes the stronger the uk bb’s are where as they don’t have the power to erase people off the map like other lines would have unless they are with in 10 km

  10. Compliments to you for acknowledging the clickbaityness of the last video (and running with it anyway); also for mentioning the battles around Guadalcanal / Henderson Field; but especially for mentioning Kirishima <3. I agree that the HE spam has gone too far and taken a lot of the joy out of the game. It's difficult for me to want to play low or mid-tier BB's anymore just because I know some limey Brit in a BB will turn me into an inferno repeatedly. In my high tier BB matches, I always enjoyed a good BB to BB close battle, firing AP from the mains while the secondaries start fires. It used to be that I'd get salty as hell when a high tier enemy BB would purposefully ram me for the kill, as though it's not a 'gentlemanly' way to play. But now - there's far more HE spam everywhere. I say reduce it's damage as the tiers increase, and the fire setting capability as well. Great video Zoup!

  11. Lighten up Francis.  The only reason we are seeing a proliferation is the relative novelty of the Royal Navy BB’s.  Once the new car smell wears off, we’ll see things go back to “normal”.

  12. The use of he in the game is overpowered. When that many people use he then thats a good sign. That being said he, He percents should go way down dramatically. and not just for battleships. He is the ruination of what could be a good game, right now using a bb in any game is suicidal with the he spam. it extremely unrealistic. and just so you know I use a new orleans from time to time . I can penetrate bb armor at max range with it. (ap shells) Ap can do more damage with a good hit but he is far more damaging when it has the stupid fire starting which is just wrong.

  13. HE spamming has been a problem since 0.6.3 on the NA server. a lot of players moving from DD’s and cruisers to BB only and just staying with the HE ammo. this has been a problem since before the British invasion. I agree HE on a BB is specifically, exclusively used by low skilled or very lazy players that never learned the game. I have hated playing lately just because honestly the only way to hurt the British ships is to load HE or risk burn down to get inside of the 8 km, range that can hurt them

  14. Cruiser captains are just bitching that BBs are using HE back on them was all fine when they were using IFHE an melting BBs and not one mention of the ships already having a HE fire reduction per tier which at tier 10 is 50% do the 46% fire chance against a tier 10 ship is actually only a 23% chance that can be further reduced using flags an cap skills

  15. your wrong BB HE do not does consisting more damage since no line but RN have 1/4 pen rule and do good damage. Germ BB do have the 1/4 pen rule but they pay for it with Substandard damage/firechance/Dispersion. Nobody cares about fires when a BB shoots HE thats what it is for. The care about HE pen damage on to of it. High Tir RN BBs are just faceroll maschines. No Chance for cits superstealth HE pes wich you cant defend yourself agist. Funny that some of the Forum idias how to nerf BBs without changing their Basic statistics are the strong Points for RN…..

  16. I would not be against them taking he down a notch I have been playing my ijn bb, s more just for the fact I can out range them and stay away from there he .

  17. What i dint get about fire is they reduced fire chance to ifhe so if they want to lower fire chance why lower it for ifhe?

  18. On fixing HE:

    Non-penetrating HE hits should only be able to do so much damage to each section of the ship. Once a section has taken a certain amount of damage, exterior HE hits simply stop doing damage.

    Make fire chance cumulative, based on hits taken over time. Fire chance reduces over time if HE hits are not taken. Chance is further reduced when a fire starts, or when one of the damage control cooldowns are used. This makes HE inefficient for BBs to use, as the time between hits will slow the fire chance buildup. This will leave HE as a viable option for faster firing ships, and also have it be very effective against a ship that is receiving focused fire (thus rewarding good coordination/team play.)

    IFHE becomes a more important skill, as it will allow HE to pen (and therefore continue doing damage.)

    Damage Control Party should heal a small percentage of fire/external HE damage. Yes, for all classes. Much less than Repair Party’s 100%, of course. This will not apply to AP damage. Repair Party remains the same. This encourages AP use, as the damage sticks. HE is still useful, but becomes more situational.

  19. Maybe Battleships could have a limited stock of HE rounds.

  20. I had a thought back in 2015 that times for fires should be reduced to 20 seconds per section. Back then I thought fires appeared on three section not four, so I thought about having it reduced to 15 seconds per section, but something about that made it seem too short, even if you had the fastest fire rate. But the idea is that instead of fires lasting 60 seconds (without modules and other stuff that reduced the time) and every new section that got lit return it back to 60 seconds, have fires per section of the ship last 20 seconds, and when another section lit up, that’s 20 seconds plus how much time was left on the first fire, and so on. That way they aren’t as deadly and as much of a nuisance as they are now, especially when your damage control is on cool down after dealing with the first set of 2-3 fires.

    I thought this more as a cruiser captain then a Battleship one because BBs are capable of ignoring 1-3 fires thanks to their large health pool and repair party that gets their health back effectively from fires. Cruisers on the other hand don’t have this until Tier 9, which to me always viewed even a single fire as a death sentence for cruisers then it is for battleships since we don’t have the same capabilities like the BBs do.

    Another idea I had was to just go like World of Tanks and add more crew member heads for the ships in charge of systems like Gunnery and Damage Control with specialized skills for each role; where Damage Control would have skills that increased survive-ability.

    One skill that came to mind, as someone suggested when I brought this up was called “All hand to Damage Control” where hp loss from fires and flooding are reduced to 50%; while sacrificing the performance in AA, secondaries and Main battery guns. (credit to skill from danredda1616)

    Honestly I like my first idea, but I do want to see the second one implemented; because lets be fair, half of the captain skills are either situational to a specific class, or lacking in importance compared to other skills in the line up.

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