A follow-up to my video discussing a possible change to game mechanics. Hope you have a wonderful day and I’ll catch you next time!
Tier IX Japanese Battleship Musashi Replay
HEY, IF THIS *MISTAKE* MAKES CONQUERORS SUFFER, IM OK WITH IT
I citadeled a fair number of KMS BB’s before 7.2, predominately at ranges exceeding 13km. Any closer and they’d have to be in a turn exposing citadel below the waterline. Really don’t see the fault if they and RN BB’s now get punished for misplays. If anything, it raises the skill floor required for brawling if it’s now possible to citadel through water.
Yes, because we really want to make it harder for most of the playerbase… I like raised skill ceilings a lot as it allows good players to excel. Raised skillfloors however is a recipy in disaster for WoWs. Also, I’ve gotten citadel hits on KM BBs in the pas too. Just usually via the gun barbette. Not via the waterline, and defo not twice in one salvo. Like I said, KM BBs trade reduced citadel hits for increased penetration damage. If the penetration damage doesn’t get reduced but citadels become more frequent then they are suddenly the most vulnerable line out there.
its a good thing overall. Its about time battleships suffer. They have been domination the meta for too long
who gives a shit about citadels if you are in a bismarck and eat 10-12 k pens all the time by some bow tanking reversing north carolinas at any angle while your guns are inaccurate as fuck and do 1000 damage hits on the superstructure while everything else sets you on fire just by staring at you no matter what gun caliber. You wanna do your job and push into the 10 km zone and by the time u get there ure at 20% or less.
Dave Jones – Battleships are supposed to ‘dominate’. By which I mean that their salvos can be brutal. Battleships do not dominate in the sense that they win games. Cruisers and especially destroyers win games. Battleships are just there to look scary and distract players from the real threat.
Wow. One good thing they did, and its actually a screw up. Haha! Hilarious. Good thing I didnt bother reinstalling until someone cleared it up. Thanks Notser.
Yeah, i will say I have been scoring more cits on German bbs, had a match where I got 2 separate cits on the same bayern, at relatively close range, about 10km
me too i got some citadels from my NC onto some german BBs, also i got a citadel from my DM on a BB(never happened before)
I once citadelled a Friedrich der Grosse with my New Orleans. In 7.1, before this bug was implemented. He was about 12km away iirc.
Comm for stats
stats oh stats 😉
hm, i liked that “bug”, but i do understand that they dont want to have something in the game they dont know how it made it there. hoping that they will implement increased citadel rate on broadsides again as a feature
they don’t like it because they have not studied the impact on the game, maybe they will keep it in the game but for now, they don’t know if maybe some battleships are citadeled too easily or something like that, they basically have to check and rebalance a third of the ships in the game. Since that is a lot of work they willl probably revert it, study it and maybe put it in later
I don’t like how cruisers are 10 times more squishy to battleships. They just suffer citadel damage more often even at long range when heading directly away from or to the attacking battleship. I feel like I have to hide more or stay at long range instead of pushing forward aggressively.
That being said, I like how destroyers can use AP more easily to quickly dispatch an attacking cruiser now.
I think its a good bug.
I saw Fem in a battle yesterday. She said that she was playing an Alabama because CVs were trash at the moment. Guess that’s a cue for me to quit trying to get decent playing them… And now WG is making those new dolphin CVs (probably April Fools). Seems SUPER logical.
Rudy Kummer , oh Fem ? ; great carrier player.
Fem is Great? Nah man, she’s feared… Feared to the point you have CV players committing suicide if ever going against her…
Cruisers get cits all the time no one bats an eye, a few BBs get cits everyone loses their mind…
Cue Joker”Everyone loses their mind” meme.
What I wanna know how are cits happening when broadside or bow on? If you are stupid enough to be sailing broadside to an enemy you deserve to be punished…
M M you understand it’s a 3 dimensional space right? Where ships can encircle you if you’re not humping a map border? You’re statement is so childish. There’s potentially 12 ships on the other side and you’re supposed to not show your broadside to all of them all time? Oh and btw, welcome to conversation and all… but cruisers don’t need to show broadside “to be punished” by battleship AP.
David Blackman I think it’s “your”. Nice try kiddo…
lol so my phone auto correct means what? I’m so glad that I completely dismantled YOUR garbage statement and YOUR rebuttal was a spelling error. Have fun with your mediocrity, son.
well I can citadel kurfurst with the baltimore from 15 km. So smth def changed!
had it with my des moines too
with the des moines is like 100% more citadels because of the insane fire rate 😀
so the one time they make a good change so that the new BB lines cant just sit broadside on at any range anymore and not have to worry about taking significant damage, it’s an accident and they’re going to “fix” it so it goes back to the skill-less meta we’ve had for ages now. they actually made it so that turtle back armor works properly and isnt immune from citadels at any range, now they’re going to revert it back .ggggggggggggggg
Stop talking trash about: yeah BBs need more skill now blabla… It’s only an issue for german BBs, otherwise the citadel mechanic is fine… Why? Because german BBs (as introduced) are unique in the way that they can go in and engage in close quarter battles without being punished as heavily as the other BBs. However, they still get punished! You still eat a lot of dmg if you are broadside in a german BB. This was a good mechanic as it resulted in more BBs actually going in and helping to cap and mostly to tank dmg, which is one of the most important roles of the BB (especially german). And by no means it is unfair…because this makes all the different nation BBs unique. The german BBs are not as good as any other nation BBs (like US) in mid to long range engagements, and that’s how it should be…it’s called balance. So for me having all the BBs getting punished the same way is only reducing the uniqueness of ship lines and furthermore making all the BB players even more scared of engaging anywhere…because that’s the current trend in the meta random games which is very unfortunate.
Just_Some_Random_Tryhard_Gamer Look even before 7.2, german BBs are the least surviving line of any BBs and if they get citadeled as well, they need some huge buff to make them at least enjoyable, but it may kill their unique experience. Germans in this game always been the one who initiates CQC against others wheter it’d a dd or a ca all likes getting closer to a certain degree. And if they can’t keep it with their BBs which is their selling point, they will lost their this unique side. And it is not good. Heck even before FDG is a bad ship and now whole line gets unnecessary nerf? No. That’s not good.
I’d rather have wg give them better sigma – to improve accuracy… Than sometimes see German BBs – that broadside for the whole game – taking 15k-30k dmg – only to heal half of it (as 50% penetration of penetration dmg is healable) – and carry on broadsiding as if nothing happens…
For dmg farmers – its heaven for them to farm off citadel-proof broadsiding idiots – but this is bad for the game – one its time consuming – and distracts them from the main objective, aka cap control…
Let’s not forget – German Battleship Citadels are still impenetrable at point blanks – as they still take advantage of the autobounce mechanic with their turtlebacks, to deflect shells away from the citadel.
Im going to also add, yeah German battleships take lots of penetration dmg from the deck and superstructure, but the French with their massive superstructures also take such penetration dmg. Lets not forget – practically any ship with a turtleback armour scheme – takes massive amounts of deck penetration dmg…
The IJN BBs (except Yamato) – The New Mexico, The French Battleships and lastly the German Cruisers and Battleships all use turtleback.
There are also the USN low tier battleships from – T7 and Below – that use the “The All or Nothing” armour scheme – but due to using multilayered armoured decks – makes them vulnerable to deck penetration like any other ship with Turtleback… This is the same with the RN BBs that use “All or Nothing”, they use multilayered decks very similar to that of IJN in terms of thickness and are equally vulnerable.
Infact the lower tier USN BBs have it even worst honestly, their belts only extend up to water line (excluding New Mexico with Turtleback), always receiving massive citadels – as water line shots – just bypass the main belt armour completely striking the thin citadel and these new underwater penetration mechanics – make them even more vulnerable… (Historically this led to USN developing an improved “All or Nothing” – giving their newer South Dakota, Iowa and planned Montana Class – with extensive underwater belts beneath their main belts, that extend all the way to the keel of the ship and single layer deck armour was used – making them highly resistant to deck penetrations … )
All these ships stated above take massive deck penetrations just like the German, but all these ships except German BBs are vulnerable to citadels – at any range if they show broadside, as opposed to German BBs that are still untouchable at point blanks…
All of them…having better and more accurate guns…you are still comparing apples with pairs and neglecting that the BB lines should feel different in their playstyle…that’s what makes the whole game interesting btw I agree that people sailing broadside should get punished, but not by inducing boring gameplay instead…which is really what this change will achieve
How is it boring? Look at the French Battleships – they have 0 armour when it comes to HE Spam, they have piss-poor dispersion like the Germans (but have better penetration by like 5-10%) – they have strong main belts and decent turtlebacks – that make them very tanky – but are very vulnerable even to cruisers at range and powerful secondaries (but without the German 1/4 HE pen)… Yet people still fight with it in close brawls or mid ranges… The only gimmick they have that makes them so different – is that Speed Boost past T8 and above, 90% of the time the only thing its good for is for repositioning, kiting – or using it to dodge torps… And most importantly – French turtlebacks – like all other turtlebacks they arent citadel proof as opposed to RN and KMS turtlebacks – and they will take massive dmg for broadsiding…
Another example is the Roma – she is spam-proof, with a massive citadel – and really inaccurate guns… But that dont stop people of brawling in and nuking everyone else point-blank, ensuring most shells hit as long as you angle.
Another is Izumo – clearly an odd ship in the IJN family, very inaccurate and unreliable guns (to the point were rivalling Gneisenau’s and Dunkeks – in how unreliable it is). The IJN are generally dubbed as a sniper – the Izumo does not, and with its 32mm armour – and one of the worst stealth in the game – it is very very very hard to stay alive long enough so that you can brawl hard… Izumo is an excellent brawler, easily the best brawler of IJN BBs – when you time it correctly away from major HE spam. It carries a turtleback that isnt citadel – proof but it is very hard to hit – for being very low in the water line, suited to killing ships with vulnerable citadels…
When you say “boring gameplay” – I think you should play the Yamato – to discover the true meaning of boring gameplay… All you do is sit there on your ass – bow on all game (I hate the bow-on meta as equally as the citadel-proof meta) – and tanking away (as long as you dont get spammed by conquerors or lots of cruisers), and nuking everything before you… “nuking everything before you” isnt as a bold statement as before – cause essentially 50% of all BBs are citadel-proof only until recently, which is a factor of why Yamato’s are super fucking passive most games… You can’t happily manuever, reposition or retreat if ever – as you will always be “angled lock” to the same spot – if multiple BBs are targeting you, as all you need is a single broadside to sink – or end up so low – you just become even more useless, trying to hide in game
You talk as if German Battleships are no longer citadel-proof but they still are, and always will be until they raise the autobounce angles! German Battleships are still citadel-proof unlike every other nation currently… Meaning they are still god’s at brawls… Pushing in will be a lot harder – but so does every other ship, and unlike other battleships – once you get to brawling range, im really just repeating myself here…
Years ago Nagato – was considering heavily armoured as fuck back in Beta – now she is super fucking squishy – easily the squishiest battleship of T7… Why? it was because people were in aw of her turtleback… Even the slightest angling made her citadel impenetrable – as it angled both the belt and armour… German armour is far superior with thicker belts and even further inclined turtlebacks – so as long as you angle, use islands to stop cross fires and find away to brawl in – you will be fine like always with your citadel untouchable…
Honestly – all this talk about how its going to make it super passive – yeah for German Battleships – they might play even more passive… But for ships with actual citadels – this won’t bother them as they get citadeled for broadsiding anyways, and will actually more likely push harder and brawl harder – knowing ships like the British Battleships are no longer citadel-proof… As for those that like to stay in the back – well unfortunately “cowardice” – the real cause of passive gameplay (unless your an Asashio or RN BB spamming HE, or in a German BB thinking you can snipe) will only resort to poor earnings and loses like always…
On *this* topic, WarGaming is showing the transparency needed to build consumer trust. It’s not hard, it’s just “Hey, we heard you, we’re seeing the same thing, we tested it, we haven’t figured it out yet.” There’s no silence, no denials, no corporate double-speak bull$#!t. If they did this more, they’d get less hate overall because their audience would be less exhausted from their persistent crap.
Dude – put down the pipe – have some respect for youir brain
Actually what I might think is that when WG fix the visual effect of waves and splashes of water “blocking” the view of a ship, they accidentally reduced the effective thickness of “water” as a physical object. Just for example and this is VERY WRONG, but just visual it like this. BEFORE 7.2 the water consist of 0.5 meter of air which triggers the shell “splashing” effect. AT 7.2 they lowered this layer to reduce the height and gravity effect on the splashes, this change however causes the shell to detonate/trigger much deeper inside water compared to pre-7.2. Just guessing.
Actually I didnt recognize the reduced splash effect. I still cant shoot a dd for like 1-2 seconds after shots have missed him closely. You just dont see where he is turning – only guess, kind of “blind fire” and hope, he keeps sailing in a straight line or only wiggling slightly, respectively.
how about Iowa and Missouri having German Dispersion?
Alefy Music and Yamato’s citadel.
Roma – has a massive citadel – and has crap accuracy – and is HE spam-proof like a German or Yamato… and that ship – still plays like a fucking beast when played right along with proper angling… So your point is invalid…
Finally BB players will be punished again for playing like dumbasses. Sailing broadside then dodging at the last moment is not a valid strategy.
IMO, only ship class that can citadel BBs should be other BBs. Exceptions are T10 cruisers at short ranges, <10km
I spend money on all their games. It’s the people that don’t that seem to be doing most of the complaining.
Gold is the same reason I stopped playing tanks, I mean I throw money at premium tanks and the like but the ammo is not needed. I hope they get rid of it one day or nerf the crap out of it because that game is truly pay to win.
I actually like how it is now……..stupid play got punish more. This is what this game need.
My AP does nothing but overpen cruisers now >.> Julio Cessare firing at Cleveland @ 10km away full broadside. 6 overpens…. Alsace firing at Baltimore full broadside @ 8km 7 overpens. >.> <.<
Normally, you would have been deleted son.
Glad to know I’m not the only one who noticed an overabundance of over-pens on shit that would normally be Citadel City and insta-deletes for sailing broadside on to a BB, or even my USN cruisers with their american AP.
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