World of Warships- Kurfurst IFHE

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*laughs in German*

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41 Comments:

  1. just play the game on the settings you are used to

  2. U mainly used AP why not HE on destroyers and badly angled ships?

    • +Fred Midtgaard np happy to be of help ^^,

    • +Patrick Joergensen thank u so much

    • +Patrick Joergensen are you a new player ? Though if you’re in cruise use he. Because dds Armor actually can bounce cruises ap if he angel accordingly. But bb’s ap hurt like hell to angel dd. So shoot when he is bow to you for maximum damage. When he is now the AP shell actually have time to pen. And you’ll get full pen DMG. Which is around 4000 and for a dd that’s a lot ! 2 or 3 pen and few over pens and dd is dead !

    • Sea Lord Mountbatten

      By the time I would switch to HE, I could have already put 2 salvos of AP on the target. Also if you manage to get the AP round to overpen the bow or stern armor of the DD, you’ll deal massive damage to them.

    • Patrick Joergensen

      4.3k matches so not exactly a new player no 😛 My entire comment about AP vs DDs was only battleship related; when I play cruisers I use AP only against close broadsiding cruisers and battleships (unless it’s my German ships as their AP hurts as well at medium/long range depending on the targets squishiness) and use HE for everything else 😛

  3. Rahulaanchal Gupta

    Pls try to do a montage of brawling with ifhe as it does not exactly show it’s power in this video..

  4. Hey Sea Lord, have fun with IFHE.
    Full mode GUI etc. would be wonderful, so all viewers could see faster more.

    As you do not anytime use all heals… and preventetive maintenance or priority target (depends on playstyle) is not anytime helpful….what about a really full sec build with manual so one Tier 1 skill, AR, BFT, AFT, Manual, IFHE (I use that on my Big Mami, fun fun fun).

    On other ships (Republique, Alsace) I skipped AFT for manual, IMHO more hits and equipped concealment expert, due to common (meh) Tier X tactic of the majority.

    Keep up your good work

  5. While i understand now with your mouse its not a detriment to you, it is making things far less easy to see while watching. Ship names for instance, also on the minimap. We dont have enough overview to really know whats going on .

    But thats just my personal opinion. you do you.

    Edit: Wow that was one very stupid yamato.

  6. wants to test GK secondaries.. goes without manual .. lolz .. also “cmon IFHE” when dealing shima was kinda pointless since u pen him even without ifhe just fine

    • Evangeline Anovilis

      The Yamato is the only target where IFHE actually would make a difference. Salem too wouldn’t need IFHE to get damaged.

    • Sea Lord Mountbatten

      i probably should’ve been a bit clearer in my intro, I was gonna go with manual secondaries with my GK build, but decided to try IFHE first for a while, then try manual secondaries.

    • Evangeline Anovilis

      tbh, Manual Secondaries is the better option for 14th point, imo. It is better to have reliable secondaries against two classes, with fire setting on the third over having unreliable damage dealers for all.

  7. Evangeline Anovilis

    Never speak before the shells land.

    To give more insight on IFHE skill to readers: IFHE (Inertia Fuze for High Explosive) increases HE penetration by 30%, in exchange for reducing fire chance by 3% (or 1%, if the guns have less than 139 mm caliber). Usually, HE penetration is 1/6 of its caliber, rounded to the nearest integer and must be at least 1 mm higher than the armour it wants to pierce. For example, Mogami has 155 mm shells. 155 mm/6=25.83, which rounds to 26. Mogami can pen up to 25 mm of armour, which would be most cruisers at its tier and lower tier BBs. Cleveland has 152 mm guns. 152/6=25.33, which rounds to 25, Cleveland thus cannot pen 25 mm armour.

    This is important, as it explains why basically every light cruiser with HE and T6+ would want this skill (except Nürnberg). Without IFHE, a Cleveland would not be able to penetrate most of the cruisers it faces, not to mention none of the BBs. It would be entirely reliant on either hitting the superstructure (which at some point gets saturated) and fires. If you however add IFHE, then suddenly, that pen gets increased by 30% and adds up to 25.33×1.3=32.93, so 33 mm of HE pen, sufficient to harm most BBs it faces. Typically, IFHE allows 150/152/155/180 mm guns to get past the 32 mm treshold of harming high tier BBs (203 mm have enough caliber to not need it and gain nothing meaningful from the skill) and can give 120/127/128 mm guns enough penetration to get past 25 mm armour, which means cruisers and mid-tier BBs.

    Now, exceptions to the HE pen rule exist, which are German cruiser guns of 15 cm and larger, German BB main battery guns, German BB secondary guns of 128 mm and larger, RN BB main battery guns and the IJN 10 cm Type 98 guns (found on Akizuki, Kitakaze, Harugumo and Harekaze as main battery, on Kii, Taihou, Hakuryu and Zao as secondary battery). For all of these the HE penetration is 1/4 of its caliber.

    For secondary builds, IFHE can sometimes help expand the range of viable targets, especially at upper tiers, so while WoWS tells you that IFHE is not suitable for BBs (and indeed, the main battery rarely profits), IFHE secondaries actually can be useful (though be aware that it typically is just making you invest even more skill points into something very situational). Given IFHE costs 4 skill points, for light cruisers, it often is a no-brainer (Cleveland and Chapayev might even want to get it before getting CE, because without it, you just don’t do any meaningful damage, which is terrible for high dpm ships), but for BBs, you really need to consider, what will your ship actually penetrate that it couldn’t penetrate before. On most battleships, the IFHE skill is a waste of 4 skill points and it certainly is less important than manual secondaries on any BB that goes for secondary build.

    So, what are the benefits for selected few secondary builds:
    Low tier BBs: Many shoot AP. Some like Iron Duke are all HE. They usually are decent vs same tier ships, but would need IFHE to pen T6+BBs. Given how questionable low tier secondary builds are in general, don’t do it though.
    Scharnhorst/Bismarck/FdG: I’m grouping these together, because they all feature the same types of secondaries, that is German mixed 10.5 cm DP guns and 15 cm anti-surface. 15 cm anti-surface already get the 1/4 pen and can deal with BBs fine, 10.5 cm though are 1/6 pen and as 105/6=17.5, they cannot even pen DDs of T8 or higher (as they have 19 mm hull plating, only occasional hits on the tiny superstructure does damage). With IFHE, you basically allow these guns to pen DDs and and BB superstructure. Value is kind of questionable, compared to leaving them as firestarters and getting survivability skills instead.
    Massachusetts: 127 mm guns get boosted past 25 mm. You basically can shred lower tier BBs and most cruisers with these guns once you get IFHE. Without, it’s DD and RN light cruisers only. Worthwhile investment.
    Richelieu/Alsace/Republique: The secondaries on these ships are similar to German ones, with 152 mm and 100 mm guns (and 127 mm at times). Unlike with German secondaries, all three of these are on 1/6 pen and all three benefit from IFHE. Without, you basically can only pen DDs with the larger guns and otherwise set fires. With IFHE, DDs get shredded, but you can also do some damage to BBs and cruisers. The larger payoff makes this more worthwhile than on Germans.
    Großer Kurfürst/Gneisenau: These are two German ships that get 12.8 cm guns. As they are 1/4 caliber penetration guns, they get 128/4=32 mm of penetration. They penetrate up to 31 mm of armour. This is not bad. In fact, these are the best secondaries without IFHE, as they will harm DDs and your typical non-Russian T10 cruiser (and everything below) without issue. Fast firing, these guns can stop a rushing torp boat quite fast (if you turn away and increase the amount of time they need to spend under secondary fire). The IFHE on these guns only serves one purpose: Pushing these guns to where they can harm BBs. With IFHE secondaries, noone can really bowtank you, except another Kurfürst. Everyone else will just eat secondary damage till they die, as long as you stay alive. You can forget you have rear turrets, go almost bow in, so as to not get wrecked through the weak side armour and let secondaries farm them.
    Kii: I only cover this due to 10 cm guns. IJN secondary builds are frankly sketchy. Most shoot AP on big guns and the small guns are at best left as anti-DD guns. After all, while the Massachusetts at T8 gets basically Gearing guns. Yamato at T10 gets Shimakaze guns. And if you don’t know your DDs, Gearing is a good gunboat which spams out shells. Shima is not. At least Yamato secondaries don’t have the atrocious IJN turret traverse. Anyway, Kii gets Akizuki guns and is the only IJN BB that gets those. Kii also gets torpedoes, so, one might consider full brawler build. But frankly, Kii is not a IJN Tirpitz. Unlike Tirpitz, Kii has no good citadel protection, it is 32 mm almost everywhere, eating HE pens all the time and is not a ship you want to brawl a lot in. Add to that that the secondaries only have 5 km base range (so 7.5 km if fully upgraded) and you won’t gun down BBs fast with 8 guns only. If you really need a BB to your side dead fast (and you should kill it fast before it kills you) use your 10 gun main battery and 3 torps. Hardest knockout blow at T8. Kii is not a brawler! AFT and BFT are the only secondary-related skills I’d use and only because Kii with AA range mod is an AA fortress. Just for comparison: Gneisenau at T8 has 0.5 km more secondary range and 4 guns more per side, all firing marginally slower. From experience though, given these guns reload fast and have 1000 m/s muzzle velocity, at the 6 km range with AFT, even without manual secondaries you get a good few hits in.

    Secondaries on GK and Gneisenau are likely not the ones who gain most from IFHE (Gneisenau can pen same tier BBs with their 25 mm plating just fine and Kurfürst only penning cruisers and DDs without IFHE is already more potent than Massachusetts with IFHE), but it is basically the ultimate secondary build. This is what true secondary dedication looks like (not what peak performance looks like though). 18 points, 12-15 which are only dedicated to this.

    And I’d say, to truely measure the impact IFHE had, you’d have to look at damage you did to Yamato, because Salem you would hurt anyway. IFHE gives no benefit there. In fact, Manual Secondaries would likely have reaped better results on the Salem and Shimakaze. I hope you can get the other 4 points for Manual Secondaries, because the accuracy matters. My Thea Kreutzer on Kurfürst sadly only has 17 points so far, 200k exp away from IFHE. But we’ll get there, Sealord. One day. With Legendary module.

  8. Evangeline Anovilis

    On settings, I personally use alt interface, because it gives me more readily the hp info. Play however you like it though. I do recommend though to enable display of spotting and potential damage. It’s hardly cluttering up much and helps at times understand how important one’s contribution can be through tanking and scouting.

  9. Yea you didn’t set it up right you need to squeeze 3 skills in the 4 point line to make it work. Manual secondaries plus the IFHE plus the range on the secondaries. It’s night and day from what you just did. Iv had games in it with 400 secondaries hits 6 kills and 90k damage on the secondaries alone not including the fires. What you were not seeing is not stop secondary hits. If you had it on manual the Salem would of literally melted. Focused fire is not the same thing you don’t get the accuracy bonus. True you got to fire at the Yamato and Salem at the same time but with manual you could of picked say the Yamato and just wrecked the Salem with the main guns at that range and have done 30K damage to the Yamato by the time you got your guns turned back around. The secondaries only struggle with German bbs they have that extra bow armor and it neutralizes a lot of it. But after over 600 games in a GK set up with ifhe manual secondaries I can say what it can do. You will get about 330 damage for every single hit on other battleships. But the good stuff is Cruisers and Destroyers you will get about 500 damage for every hit on them so you learn to maximize the pain and switch targets as better ones come into range. I have seen double and even a triple close quarter award in gk the increased accuracy from manual is the key.

    • It’s reversed the lighter armored ships take more damage then the bbs but the bbs still take over 300 per secondary hit. For me 45-60k secondary damage is the norm on a halfway decent GK game. As for why the lighter ships tend to average more per hit it could be you are getting cit hits from your secondaries with ifhe where you not going to cit a Battleship with a 128 mm gun firing he.

    • Evangeline Anovilis

      Ok, let’s be real here. As this isn’t WoT, HE damage is only determined by whether it penned or not and whether it citpenned or not. A non-penetrating hit always deals 0 damage, a penetration always deals 33% damage, a citadel is 100% of the listed damage. Overpens don’t exist with HE (AP in this case deals 10%). So, any shell that actually does deal damage either does 1/3 or full. The listed damage of the 12.8 cm secondaries is 1500, so a penetration is around 500, a citadel is 1,500.

      Possible explanations for what you explained are only two:
      -Damage saturation kicked in and the parts hit were already mostly saturated, thus reducing damage. In this case, a pen would deal around 250 damage.
      -You averaged the hits. In which case, BBs have more area that is belt or on some other BBs deck that can be inpenetrable. For example, it’s very hard to get damage on other Germans, except with hits on the upper bow, stern and superstructure. In this case, a lot of hits simply did 0 damage. This is what I think it is.

      It is very unlikely that you citpenned things with IFHE secondaries. The sole time 12.8 cm secondaries citpen is maybe when a Gneisenau meets an Emerald with its 25 mm citadel roof, but at T10, it’s basically impossible.

    • Gk has 2 kinds of secondaries the 128s with IFHE overpen 40mm the 150s with the IFHE overpen 48mm. Now the over match mechanic is any angle but flat on they would pen a lot more then that. So if you hit a cruiser like say a mino they most certainly can Cit. I think your over thinking it it doesn’t matter why it acts this way it matters that it does. A bb is going to have turrets and barbettes and exposed belts all of which will shatter low cal HE shells. Which is probably why notice I get about 40% less damage on BBs then I do on cruisers and destroyers. But look at https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yaNS4YVGcyQ&t=6s this shows what they can do and I can confirm the secondaries alone can sink a Yamato in under 2 mins.

    • Evangeline Anovilis

      First off, let’s clarify two terms:
      Overpen is when a shell enters the ship, does not arm and leaves the ship before detonating. Only AP does that, as only AP does not arm and explode immediatly upon contact.
      Overmatch is the mechanic by which an AP shell will automatically penetrate any armour that is less than its caliber divided by 14.3. HE does not do that. HE penetrates anything that is less than its caliber divided by 6 (or 4 in exceptional cases) and immediatly detonates.

      If you look at any T10 cruiser, or even T9, none of them have a citadel that is seperated from the outside by 48 or less mm of armour. Even Minotaur the most fragile has citadel belt thicker than that. And if you don’t hit the stretch above the citadel, say, you hit the bow, the HE shell will detonate on the bow and deal damage to the bow, but never reach a citadel. This is a reason you pretty much cannot citadel a Hindenburg with HE, because the citadel does not border the hull anywhere above the waterline (and HE shells detonate upon hitting the water, which does no damage to the ship (except if you detonate), but might knock out nearby modules.

    • I’m sorry I don’t have the patients to go around in circles with you on this. I told you the results I get what more can I do.

  10. Ludwig von Siegfried

    Congratulations for 700!

  11. You still need manual secondaries really

  12. Its worse at tier V… so many high rank captains in there its not funny… Bunches of lame people playing King Shit of Tier V vs. people who are just starting. lol I love killing these people with a 1 point captain they cry so much.

  13. Please look at a new mic or at least adjusting your settings. Very loud and boomy. How far is mic from your mouth?

  14. Mrdenden says kurfurst has 1/4th penetration value; it already has ifhe baked in 🙂 like the hindenburg and other Germans

  15. waste of points without manual secondaries. I either go MS/IFHE/AFT but without concealment or leave AFT for concealment u get less range but ifhe is for penning the bow on target anyways . Ifhe will melt even a bowon montana lol

  16. To be fair to your dd’s at A, they did have two radar cruisers camping it. Pretty sure that would have been insta-death about 2 secs after the cap started to flip, unless maybe they came in from B

  17. Pls do a vid showing how u allocate which fingers to which functions on average gaming mouse and other recommendations re setting up a gaming mouse for wows? ( I guess right handed)

  18. take manual secondaries and second interceptor instead of superintendant and turret traverse for this bild.

  19. those torpedo beats…!

  20. I prefer the legendary upgrade with 420 guns the 406 are t8 guns. Yes you lose range but 27 second reload. Makes it an awesome brawler

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